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  #1  
Old 05-09-2006, 08:30 PM
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Default Ethanol Fuel

Ethanol, have you been reading up on it. Sounds like trouble to me. They say it's bad for fiberglass tanks, shelf life is 60 to 90 days, stirs up junk in your tanks, mixes with water. When it goes bad ,the hole tank of gas is bad? with the old gas(MTBE) the water went to the bottom of the tank. You could suck it out.
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  #2  
Old 05-10-2006, 07:35 AM
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I know when I was in the army and stationed over in korea we would pour denatured alcohol in our tanks to absorb any water that was in the tank and burn it off. But then again, that was a Multi fuel huge Detroit turbo charged V6.
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Old 05-10-2006, 08:38 AM
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AAlchol and boating do not mix... doesnt matter if you consume it or it's being consumed in your boat....

The old myth that alchol absorbes water is just that.. a myth... what it does do is MIX with the water and the gasoline allowing the mixture to be burned, thats OK on a four stroke motor but sudden deathe to a two stroke (yes even oil injected) outboard, the mixture washes the lubricating oil off the bearing and wear surfaces causing premature engine wear and bearing failure...

AS it applies to boating , the next issue arrises because alcahols ability to absorb water, it will absorb water from the atmosphere, once the gasoline/alchol solution becomes saturated with water to the point where it no longer can absorb anymore it phase seperates, what this means is the water molecules become more dense and sink to the bottom of the tank, it then starts the process again....

In an automobile this is usaly not an issue, the auto's are driven almost daily, rapidly cycling the fuel in their tanks, another factor is fuel tank size, when was the last time you saw a 150 gallon tank in a car?

Those that have been around boating for 20 years or so will remember the fuel issues in the '80's ,I was working s a full time Mercury Marine mechanic at the time and spent extensive time dealing with and being schooled on this problem, it was only a matter of time before it reoccured.

Trouble ahead!
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Old 05-10-2006, 12:30 PM
TonyDB TonyDB is offline
 
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Double thread.

Here's what I said in the other thread.

From what I've read, your water/fuel seperator won't work with ethanol because ethanol mixes with water. In fact ethanol is quite hydroscopic...it will absorb moisture right out of the air. Why, because alcohols have hydroxyl groups (-OH) which readily bond to H2O.

I agree, moving to a high or all ethanol fuel could really create issues for us boaters. Both 2-strokes and 4-strokes should be modified to effectively run on ethanol. Without modifications, our motors will either run like crap, ethanol being about 33% less efficient, or not run at all.

4-strokes are an easier modification because they use a carburater that can be more readily adjusted to compensate for the richer running, less fuel efficient ethanol. Basically the air to fuel ratio needs to be adjusted allowing more fuel to enter the combustion chamber.

2-strokes present the biggest problem with their fuel injecters. The sensors need to be reprogramed for the higher ratio, something that requires special equipment, would prove difficult to accomplish in a retrofit, and be very costly. Also, the standard 2-stroke oil doesn't mix readily with ethanol. It has been proposed that Biodeisel could be used as an alternative to the traditional 2-stroke oil but limmited studies have been done.

Then you have all the other issues associated with it being a more aggresive solvent that may require new hoses, fittings, and tanks (if fiberglass)....to say nothing about it solvating the sludge at the bottom of my 18 year old boat's gas tank and fowling up everything.

If it goes this way there's going to be some bumpy roads ahead for us boaters and the boating industry in general.

Guess my next motor won't be and E-tec. Frankly, it kinda makes sense to hold off on buying a boat/engine until this sorts itself out and the actual manufacturers get on board.

PS: I just re-read my post and I sound like chicken little. Hope it doesn't happen as I predict.
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Old 05-10-2006, 06:49 PM
sadlsorz sadlsorz is offline
 
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Ok now you've scared the bejesus out of me. So I can basically kiss my outboard goodbye, what the heck are we supposed to do?
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Old 05-11-2006, 08:02 AM
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Keep in mind that this will be a evolutionary transition starting with E-10 (10% ethanol). The question that bothers me is how much ethanol does it take to really create these issues? My guess is that 10% will have a minimal effect, but I don't know.

Here's a paper written by a group of Dartmouth students where they retrofitted a 4-stroke to run on ethanol.

http://www.dartmouth.edu/~ethanolboa...nal_Report.pdf
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Old 05-11-2006, 08:43 AM
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I spoke to my Johnson dealer and he said that engines manufactured after 1988 will be ok with E10. As you stated Tony, any higher and I don't know. He did say, however, that for the firat couple of tanks you should keep an eye on your fuel filter, as it most likely will get clogged fast by the junk from you fuel tank.
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Old 06-19-2006, 08:23 AM
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The misery has begun for some boat owners, the new E-10 had done in many a boater...

The tow boats were busy hauling broken down boats this weekend, the E-10 has loostend all the varnish sitting in some of the older fuel tanks clogging the fuel filters...

Keep and eye on you fuel filters, check often and carry a SPARE!
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