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Penn 704z

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704z penn
148K views 253 replies 44 participants last post by  cunezstun 
#1 ·
Well i decided to do some rock hopping this fall in Montauk so i picked up a Penn 704z, did all the tricks, made my holes, painted it(no powder coat yet),got a sealed bearing, new handle,drag,drag knob,shaft and manual bail(not sure how this works) My question is do you guys pack the reel with grease? I mean really pack it tight or just lob a lot by the entryways? Thanks in advance.
 

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#37 ·
Ordered some needles from VXB. 8mmx12mmx10. Thought the size was 7mm, found a 7mm bearing and didn't fit so i went with8mm. Needles were relatively cheap,needle-3.95,clutch needle-5.95. Found a good website Dynaroll.com for the flanged bearings. No pricelist on the web so i ordered a catalog.
 
#38 · (Edited)
Not able to edit...........lol Will try to use needle by the pinion but the bottom of those teeth will grind it up so might have to place a flanged bearing on top of it, they're only 3mm long. Or maybe skip the needle and put flanged on top and regular bearing inside to cover 10mm in length thats needed!Hmmm :icon_stirthepot: Trying to find a sleeve bushing for the spool(Dynaroll).
 
#39 ·
Let me know what you are looking for as we deal with some companies that have everything under the sun. SOme of the things I can get are not sold outright as they are made for specific designs owned by some of the companies we deal with. I can buy them with an agreement I won't sell them, they are supposed to be used for the specific purpose they are made for but oh well, close enough. As long as I don't use to make a new product they are fine with it. I also have several trays of assorted bearings from vehicles, wheelchairs, scooters and lifts we work on.
I'm not sure why you need a bushing or sleeve for the spool though as the washers lock it in place. The only way it spins on shaft is through the drag washers

Added: To be able to edit I think you need to have a certain number of posts
 
#40 · (Edited)
Whats up Brian! There's a bushing under the drag in the body of the spool that spins when the drag peels out. Just thought new bushing should help! Anyway, i got a little play on my anti-reverse even with a new ratchet so i'm thinking a one way clutch under the pinion would give me instant anti-reverse. Thing is those teeth on the pinion gear are gonna grind the main housing or the bearing housing, depending on how deep i push the needle in. That bushing has a groove on top that those teeth ride on. You'll see that when you take it out. So i'm thinking of using a flanged bearing for those teeth to run on and still use the clutch needle underneath to help out with the anti-reverse. Dynaroll had long sleeved flanged bearings but in larger size only. We need 8x12x10(metric) for the pinion, and a bit longer in the handle. If you know a place to get that brother, were in! :notworthy: BTW I checked out Mikes and those custom Abu's are awesome! I'm thinking with Christmas coming up..... :yay:why not! The blue 7000 w/ that stainless handle is a jewel!
 
#41 ·
Those reels are awesome. I had spoke with more than one person that had got a Blue and love it. Mike's don't mess around. I won't be in till next week some time to check my trays. If I don't have something then I will make a couple calls. In the mean time I may just open the reel up and take a peek as I may be able to come up with something. I think with the anti-reverse, the play is natural w/ these reels. I will look at that also, I should have remembered that but it was a long day of ripping up 1/2 bathroom floor repairing a leaky cracked toilet and cutting out some old drain pipe to replace w/ PVC and a new closet flange. I had the toilet in and out 3 times till I realized the crack. I hate working in tight bathrooms

Also instead of a flange bearing for the pinion why not go with a regular bearing and a stainless washer, isn't the bushing non flanged? again I will take a peek
 
#42 ·
Also instead of a flange bearing for the pinion why not go with a regular bearing and a stainless washer, isn't the bushing non flanged? again I will take a peek
Yea it's a straight sleeved bushing but on one end (top) it has groove,very small, that the bottom of the pinion teeth ride in. It'll make more sense when you look at it! My buddy just picked up a Greenie from e-bay. ( I talked him out of getting a VanStaal..........lol)
 
#43 ·
Got my needles and caliper last night. Correct measurement for pinion bushing 8mmx11mmx10mm,the only bearing i could find was 8mmx12mm. Had to mill 1mm out of the housing to make it fit but it worked!:yay: The one way i also ordered is not a one way:smilierun: but that was for the handle so it can wait. If you guys want to use reg bearing, just mill 3 or 4mm in the housing so it lays inside, i'll prob do that on the other reel, too late for this one! Ordered some bushings and main gear. When i get those i will measure bushings for the handle and post. Seems to be 33.5mm long. I'm thinking 22mm long one way needle in the middle with two flanged bearings on both ends!:a_goodjob: That would make it a 5 bearing reel! lol My girls away with the camera, i'll post some picks on wednsday!
 
#51 ·
Got my needles and caliper last night. Correct measurement for pinion bushing 8mmx11mmx10mm,the only bearing i could find was 8mmx12mm. Had to mill 1mm out of the housing to make it fit but it worked!:yay: The one way i also ordered is not a one way:smilierun: but that was for the handle so it can wait. If you guys want to use reg bearing, just mill 3 or 4mm in the housing so it lays inside, i'll prob do that on the other reel, too late for this one! Ordered some bushings and main gear. When i get those i will measure bushings for the handle and post. Seems to be 33.5mm long. I'm thinking 22mm long one way needle in the middle with two flanged bearings on both ends!:a_goodjob: That would make it a 5 bearing reel! lol My girls away with the camera, i'll post some picks on wednsday!
Why is it to late? You can always mill out more, it's a bit more work to put it back though. There are a few ways to make it smaller though. If you want we can mill out more even if it's oblonged from the dremel:lff3:. Is it safe to take out that much though as ther can be some pretty heavy stress there.
 
#45 ·
No Jack, i was on my couch with my Dremel tool. I had a grinding stone that was the same size almost and couldn't wait. Used the low setting and started to take some stuff off(out)while trying to hold it straight and after some time of grinding and trying to slip the needle in,in she went. I didn't grind all the way through,left a little space at the end to use as a stopper so the needle will never slip through. I also placed a copper washer 9mmx12mm in between the pinion gear and the needle bearing so there's no grinding.:icon_stirthepot::a_goodjob:
 
#46 ·
No Jack, i was on my couch with my Dremel tool. I had a grinding stone that was the same size almost and couldn't wait. Used the low setting and started to take some stuff off(out)while trying to hold it straight and after some time of grinding and trying to slip the needle in,in she went. I didn't grind all the way through,left a little space at the end to use as a stopper so the needle will never slip through. I also placed a copper washer 9mmx12mm in between the pinion gear and the needle bearing so there's no grinding.:icon_stirthepot::a_goodjob:
Yhat's what I thought, Do you see that it needs to be copper as I was thinking stainless like I posted above. After I posted that I was also thinking a bronze washer might be better, I doubt it though. Well I need to know, how's it feel?
 
#47 ·
Much smoother:banana: , can't immagine how it's gonna be after the other ones.Now if i could only find some 8mmx11mm bearings and not touch the housing, just plop'em in, i would spring for a NEW housing! Wondering if the 704 and the 706 are the same size housing(hoping anyway)! :a_goodjob:
 
#49 ·
I know, just couldn't wait. Figured i sacrifice housing to see if it's doable. Still wanna meet up after season and do it RIght! Maybe i'll pick up a 706 by then.:whistle: Waiting on Dynaroll's catalog. It seems they have more of a bearing selection. If i can find 8mmx11mm, i'll pick up a bunch for us. I'm also looking at gasket materials. Thinking about cutting a gasket for the housing plate to seal it up and maybe finding an o-ring for the main gear shaft that protrudes outside the handle.We'll see! My buddy Rich is coming in from jersey for the weekend so we'll be STALKING STRIPERS! :lff3: Seems as the bass bite picked up around here! Tight lines Brian!:a_goodjob:
 
#50 ·
I've been thinking about milliing around the housing and set an o ring into it help seal the body. One of the guys at the shop said he may be able to shape the o ring, if not it should still work. If the ring is long then I will jut have to seam it. I also have some thin rubber that I could use and might be easier. I think we have several different thickness'. If the place is still there, we used to deal with a place that made gaskets accross from our old shop. They always gave me the stuff at no charge. I swear I remember measuring up some bearings at the shop a few weeks ago that may be close or the same. I feel they may be bigger though as I think they are for a steering box or rack as we modify them for low to zero effort steering and sometimes a bearing gets damaged. I was supposed to go out to fish this weekend but now I have the other bathroom ripped apart. One small little sink swap has now become building a new vanity and replumbing the whole bathroom. I also found the drain is leaking in the concrete floor, don't really want to hammer up the floor but just may have to. Gotta go I have a busy day ahead of me. Maybe I can sneak out though and head down to the Fly Tying Sympsium in Somerset NJ although that's a 45 min drive one way. I don't think the wife wants to deal with the mess another day. Oh well you know how it goes-those effing contractors never show up when there supposed to. That's me- only kidding though I'm usually where I'm supposed to be, but it's the weekend!!!

Did you check with Boca for bearings? Also do a search for Reel bearings or fishing reel bearings. One other thing is if you have a good hobby shop near you they may have something although their stuff is usually smaller. I can check the one near the shop, it's small but they have stuff from floor to ceiling. I was amazed how much stuff they fit in there little store
 
#53 ·
Wow a dremel that must have been a PITA. I was thinking a 12mil bit on a drill press. RJ you are a persistent bugger.

As far as sealing the body goes. Put a zirc in the body some where and RTV the plate to the body. remove at the end of the season. If you have the zirc in the body you can pump it with grease as needed.
 
#54 ·
I like your idea better Jackbass, Drill Press is the way to go although the Dremel serves me well! lol I measured the bushings i got from ScottsB&T and they're identical(except for the flang). Also picked up a new main gear($27.30) which i will install in the finished product. Would prefer to seal it w/ gasket of some type but if not then RTV. Ever have problems with that zirc fitting? The housing seems to me kind of thin.
 
#55 ·
I like your idea better Jackbass, Drill Press is the way to go although the Dremel serves me well! lol I measured the bushings i got from ScottsB&T and they're identical(except for the flang). Also picked up a new main gear($27.30) which i will install in the finished product. Would prefer to seal it w/ gasket of some type but if not then RTV. Ever have problems with that zirc fitting? The housing seems to me kind of thin.
There should be no stress on the zirc. Just be sure to place it where it wont get bumped , say on the topside. I myself hate silicone, I would rather use a gasket as I don't have to clean anything when I open it up. I often compare RTV to baby sh#t, it just gets everywhere and it hard to get off. I feel with the right greese (say corrision block) it should be fine once it's filled and closed up
 
#56 ·
Hope you guys had a good Thanksgiving! Now back to bussiness. So i get the handle bushings out. It turns out to be the easy part. Could not get the new ones in without damaging the bushings(they're like butter).:dizzy: So i call up Scotts B&T, looking for some wisdom! It seems they have plenty of it!:notworthy: After being told to sand the bushing down a bit with fine grit sandpaper, the guy tells me to put the bushings in the freezer( get'em nice and cold), then heat the housing to where it's nice and toasty before inserting the bushings back in( they should go in with minimal force), the heat with the cold should bond the metals really good. Makes perfect sense, only thing is i used up all the bushings i had so time to order some more in case i decide not to go with bearings.:icon_stirthepot: I also picked up a 706Z from e-bay which was used only twice, should be here by friday!
 
#60 ·
Just a note...

Last time I replaced those bushings, I was lucky enough to have an adjustable reamer handy. The ID closed up slightly when I pressed the busing in. A minor ID clean-up and the fit was perfect.
I mustered up something homemade but it still marked the ID(not adjustable,had some play on the inside). I'll see if i can find an adjustable one. Thanks Rickski!

Threw some picks in with the needle bearing. Thinking if i can use a one-way clutch bearing and keep the grease out of it when i pack it, i could have instant anti-reverse.:yay:
 

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#58 ·
SUDSY
If you read this I was wondering about the Powder coat you used. You had said that it chipped easy. Did you you send the reel out and have it blown with powder then baked or did you use the brush/dip on powder paint type like for jigs. There is a major difference between the two-Powder Coat and Powder Paint. I have had many things powder coated "professionally" and they are very/super durable. It can chip and stuff but it takes a major shot to do so if done right.

Added: I reread your post and you said you used powder paint. I now see why it chipped easily. Real powder coat is way more durable and hard, there is not even a comparison between the two.
 
#61 ·
Another way to reem out the opening is to drill it. You would need a Mill or press and numbered drill bit that is a tiny bit bigger. Fractional bits jump in sizes where numbered bits increase in size very slightly. You would want to vise it and make sure it is totally inline which is easier than it sounds. Another way to make it slightly bigger is sand with a flap paper bit. I forget the exact name but it has sanding cloth in strips. Dremel has a small one that may fit
 
#63 ·
After replacing the pinion bushing with a needle bearing and spinning it around i wasn't too happy with the free play so on my 706 i decided to go with a radial instead. I milled out 3.5mm with a 15/32(11.9mm)bit and left the bushing in. Just took width of the bearing off the top with the press. You have to be VERY carefull to be aligned correct and mill slow. I finished it by hand with a x-tra fine file and 600grit paper! I also expanded the I.O. of the bushing a little and the pinion spins like a dream. My only thought is how the bearing will hold up under pressure. That pinion might push too hard on the inner race and pop it out. We'll see! For now, one step closer to my goal. I also picked up a spare spool and drilled it out. Looks preety good.:icon_stirthepot: Merry Christmas!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!icon_santa.gif
 

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#64 ·
Just got done replacing the outer bushing on the main gear shaft with a flanged bearing. Very SMOOTH with four bearings.:a_dreaming: Now i gotta work on the anti-reverse. :icon_stirthepot: Also picked up a power knob that i attached to an old handle. I wanna put a bearing in it on the bottom wich means i have to make the knob shaft 0.5mm smaller. Anybody care to chime in as the best way to do that? It's stailess steel so i'm thinking a ss file maybe.
 

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#65 ·
Try Putting a Needle in between two flanged bearings on the handle shaft. I think it will fit. You will have to eliminate the oiler but it should fit. It will put the anti reverse in the handle. That is what I planned on doing.
 
#67 ·
That's exactlly what i tryed to do on a 704 housing,won't get into details but i need to order 13mm O.D.for that one!:lff3: As soon as my buddy brings me my spare i can drill again and test if the cylindrical shape of the needle bearing will hold under pressure. Will probably add some locktight to it so it doesn't spin but that's gotta be milled out perfect and tight. BOCA has a clutch bearing with a hexagon housing but that won't work in the handle, more likelly on top of the rotor bearing and maybe do something with the retainer to hold it in place. My head's starting to spin thinking about this again:smiliedoh: :lff3: And Jack, after this, were gonna water-seal this puppy:yay:! I think i got it figured out except for the shaft. Any idea how to make that knob shaft a little smaller? I was thinking about placing it in the chuck and as it spins putting a steel file on it until i get the right diameter.
 
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