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  #1  
Old 07-16-2009, 11:01 AM
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Default wood for turning or carving

Just wondering what is the best or wood of preferance for turning or carving. What are the advantages of thes and diadvantages. Right know I'm just messing around with some hand carves, I had used maple as I had a bunch of left over pieces from a custom closet I did. The pieces are 1 by(3/4") so they aren't much good for turning. How long should I soak the maple for in my solution of BLO and MS, I was thinking around 30 to 45 seconds or maybe up to a minute. SHould I and I fell maybe I should soak it longer due to being a harder wood?

Also I may still be able to get my hands on some Val Oil, is there any advantages to Val oil besides it not having the combustable characteristics of BLO? I here it also has a quicker cure time. I just wonder if it could be better as it's amazing how much the BLO/MS penetrates.

How about propionate, and input? Many folks swear by this but I think it coats more than penetrates

Any other pointers you may think of just throw out there, thanks

Just a couple of the hand craves, still have som tapering to do on them
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  #2  
Old 07-16-2009, 11:04 AM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

I use Alaskan Yellow Cedar for Swimmers and Mahogany for Pencils seems to be the be for them applications. I'm sure Roc will Chime in on this.
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Old 07-16-2009, 07:30 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Lots of threads on this topic,but my preference is the ayc for the pencils and poppers and mahogany for needles.(dont make many swimmers ) maybe someone else will chime in. That maple must be tough on the tools eh? I usually soak the plugs in the blo/ms for an hour at least ,dont know if its right or wrong but im usually not going to paint them for a few weeks anyway,and ive never had a problem. Like the shape of your plugs ,cant wait to see them finished
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Old 07-17-2009, 01:31 AM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Different woods for different purposes

Do what works for you.

I use AYC for most things.
I prefer more buoyant red cedar for pikies that kick their tails out of the water and for larger dannies.
I like maple for sinking needles and darters but use other woods for them as well.

Play around. When you've settled on a few patterns that you like try making them out of different woods and see how they make the plug swim.
One thing for sure, you'll learn a lot from it.
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Old 07-17-2009, 07:40 AM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Check out https://www.stripers247.com/phpBB2/sh...ad.php?t=15405

Same plug in different woods. Each swims different.
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Old 07-17-2009, 06:18 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Rickski
Those are some nice plugs. No those are some awesome plugs!!
I like the idea how you don't glue in the lip so you can change them. I hand carvng a few swim/divers and have already carved them for lexan lips (oh well)
I see many post of folks talking about using different woods on similar plug/lures but I cant find their theries on how those woods may effect the swimming if any. I imagine most of the effects are do to weight an much could also be changed by weighting the plugs in different locations. Also ith the different woods do you adjust your soak time for sealing? If so if you don't mind around how long for soft and how long for hard woods.

One other thing is are you tying your own tail hooks? If so what thread are you using to dress them? I had stopped by my local Outdoor store actually 2 different stores of the same name and ask 3 different folks there and got 2 different answers. Two of those guys I know do some of their own tying but they did not really seem sure of what to use as I think they mostly fish fresh water. Some of the ones I have done before I just used regular thread then dabbed with super glue or epoxy.
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Old 07-17-2009, 08:58 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

I use rod building thread, size D for tails. It's a bit heavier and less prone to breakage then fly tying thread.

Don't try to tie a decent fly with it though. I use it for tails because I don't care if the head is a bit large, not a good thing with most flies.
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Old 07-17-2009, 10:50 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

My Quote "I was thinking around 30 to 45 seconds or maybe up to a minute. "

I don't know what the heck I was thinking when I typed that but it should be 30 to 45 minute soak not second. What an idiot I am. I also always figured if you can't beat them then baffle them with your ignorance. When they are so amazed and confused by your stupidity then POW you can do as you please.

Thanks for everyones help
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Old 07-17-2009, 11:24 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

I epoxy before I assemble the hardware on lip swimmers because every so often one just doesn't swim the way I like and it ends up coming apart and used for kindling. This way I can reuse the hardware. On everything without a metal lip, I epoxy before hardware.

The thread I use for tails is from a fly tying shop. It's Danville's 210 denier. I told the guy behind the counter I was tying bucktails and he set me up. It is pretty tough stuff. This season I was able to get a number of deer tails from hunters on the site. One sent me about 15 from the Carolina's. I salted, dried and washed them. Dyed a few as well. Also used bear fur, and horse hair.

I like a lower density wood for Pencils, then tail weight them so they sit at about 1:00 in the water. I think anywhere between 12:00 and 2:30 will work good.

Experiment with different woods. My brother's favorite spook is one that I made from an old piece of redwood furniture he had laying around. This plug is looking pretty beat because he keeps nailing fish on it. Lower density (lighter woods) float higher in the water. Use a heavier wood for a plug that you want to use lower in the water column, such as needlefish or darters. Lots of trial and error. Something I learned from Roc is that a plug will pivot around it's heaviest point. That heavy point could be a weight, or the widest part of a wooden body.

Check out the plug making tutorials on the site. They are excellent, and I've built each of them. With what is learned with the tutorials, you can take the principals and keep applying them.
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Old 07-18-2009, 11:16 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Thank you Rickski
I also have picked up a few deertails, I got 2 which are already done and for saltwater for $2 each. I just got a new bobbin and threader from a friend, he gave it to me then I found out later it goes for around $45 and he would not take a dime.(C&F Designs) I also have some friends that are going to save me the ones(tails) they shoot plus I figure in a month or so I should be able to get them from the side of the road. When hunting season begins they get pushed out of the woods and I see several on the road a week. I should also be able to get bear soon as I think they are going to do hunt here in NJ as the bears are out of control.

I picked up and borrowed several designs to get measurements to turn them. I will have to do on a homemade or drill press lath as funds are super tight. Do you have any measurements on a bottle plug/Gibbs casting swimmer design that you could send me or help out with? 2 or 3 hook design is fine, somewhere around 6" to 7" and 2 to 3 oz. Beggars can't be choosy. I really would like to make several of these and don't have any to measure
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Old 07-19-2009, 03:36 AM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Has anyone used Propionate to seal their plugs? It comes in pellet frm usually and you dissolve it in laq thinner and some in alchohol or acetone. I think this is more of a coating I have also heard of and I think is about the same as dissolving a couple dixie or solo cups in acetone or alchohol to use as a sealer. Many lure making companies talk about this stuff as it is something they can sell you, as they really can't or should not ship BLO or MS
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Old 07-19-2009, 10:20 AM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Keep a constant eye on Craig's list for a lathe. They come up pretty cheap at times.

On propionate, I was asking the same question. Check out this link.
https://www.stripers247.com/phpBB2/sh...ght=propionate

Seems there are plus and minuses to every form of sealing plugs. The 4 that come to mind are BLO/MS, Spar Vanish/MS, Epoxy, and propionate. I use BLO/MS, with the draw back of proper disposal of rags, and waiting a week or more before applying primer. Several guys use Spar Vanish/MS with good success. I'll be trying it this year. I've tried epoxy sealing and love the way it seals wood. Gives a nice hard surface as well. Drawback is that it's messy. The propionate is suppose to work well, but I understand several dips are required to build up adequate protection. There is a guy on ebay that sells it and has instructions on how to use it. As with most things, there is more than one way, and we all end up experimenting and using what works best for us.
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Old 07-19-2009, 12:21 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

I think I can still get some Val oil. I believe it has been a discontinued product. I have a little Hardware store near me that has a ton of older stuff. I had given him a call and he's pretty sure he has it. It works like BLO but is not as combustable. Which is nice as I can induce heat to speed up the dry time, it is also not supposed to raise the grain I can also check the moisture content on the plugs to make sure they are ready.

There are quite a few place to get Propionate, it is basically a plastic. One thing I don't care about it is that it doesn't really penatrate like BLO, it is mostly coats the outer surface. Some Propionate info. Even though you do a few coats, it dries quckly between them. Either way (fully dried or not) would work fine with lacquer primer. If the propionate sealer has fully dried and all the solvents have evaporated, the solvents in the lacquer primer will etch into the propionate and bond the two together.
Tip for using propionate as a topcoat over lacquers: Spray the final paint job with one or two thin coats of clear lacquer (propionate solution can be sprayed with a airbrush in place of lacquer). I spray 3 thin coats of propionate and with in 5 minutes the bait is ready to start dipping for a final topcoat.
New tip to get a crystal clear finish on the last dip: On the final dip of the topcoat or when sealing. As soon as you remove the bait from the propionate dip hang the bait in a empty jar and place the lid on it. The best way I have found to do this, is to get a mason jar and punch 3 or 4 small hole in the center of the lid. Then bend a piece of wire into a small hook and hang it through a hole in the lid. Then as soon as the bait if removed from the propionate hang it on the hook and just place the lid on the jar. The solvents will evaporate slower and the moisture that causes the blushing will be pushed out of the top of the jar. After about 5 min. the bait can be removed and it will dry crystal clear. I am able to hang 2 or 3 baits at once in the same wide mouth jar.
1 pound of propionate pellets will seal approximately 800-1000 Bass plugs and over 400 Saltwater/Musky plugs.
Rockwell Hardness = R80


Just a little info I thought I would put out there. I would post a site with alot of info for Prop. but I don't think it is ok to do so as it is linked with a forum with a ton of info on it. There price is 6oz. dry weight $9.99.or...lb. dry weight $25.00
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Old 07-19-2009, 12:23 PM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

With the BLO/MS what would the suggested soak time be. I have used it in the past but not with lures. Also about how long for the cure. I should be able to do a moisture reading though

As for the lathe i will work something out. I will either turn on my press or make a lathe. I may even be able to pick up a lathe without a motor. It would not be I have access to motors. I also have access to a metal lathe, it is a little slow 1600rpm but I can make it do for now. I have most of the tools I need to build the lures, I really just need to get the hardware. My main focus right now is a new rod or two.
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Old 07-21-2009, 11:24 AM
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Default Re: wood for turning or carving

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickski View Post

Several guys use Spar Vanish/MS with good success. I
I love this method as you can prime a couple of hours after you seal. Generally I epoxy rigged so I get even more of a seal in the hook holes and around the grommets and in the lip slots. That is only when i am working with a proven design though.
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