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  #1  
Old 02-14-2007, 11:23 AM
Toothfish Toothfish is offline
 
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Default Lets talk about forage fish

In our Iowa lakes and streams the most abundant forage fish is gizzard shad. Although this fish is not for all lakes it seems to be what our wipers are feeding on. I wondered if this is the most prevalent bait fish across the nation or are there some other forage fish in your local lake ?
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  #2  
Old 02-14-2007, 09:09 PM
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

the Tennessee river in my neck of the woods: threadfin shad, skipjack, gizzards... and don't forget about bream(bluegills...etc).
I fished Smith Lake at night around the dock lights a few years ago for salts....they much preferred bluegills to shad.
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Old 02-15-2007, 09:55 AM
Toothfish Toothfish is offline
 
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Thumbs up Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Interesting...I have used live gills for flathead bait many times. Green sun fish are another great flathead bait....
Why not for Wipers as well.
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Old 02-15-2007, 11:21 AM
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Just make sure when using sunfish for bait, that you use small enough panfish to fit in the ole wipers mouth!
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Old 02-15-2007, 12:41 PM
Toothfish Toothfish is offline
 
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Copy that . Now for the tactics in a lake. Night ? Anchored ? Vertical jig ?
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Old 02-15-2007, 07:56 PM
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toothfish View Post
Copy that . Now for the tactics in a lake. Night ? Anchored ? Vertical jig ?
The night fishing we did was for salts...I really don't know if this is a good technique for hybrids or not. I mainly fish tailraces and, although I love catchin' 'em, don't "target" hybrids....I just fish for stripahs(salts and hybs).
If that's not happening, I'll try for some whites. As LittleMiamiJeff can probably attest, tailrace fishing is a good bit different than lake fishing.

The best advice I can give you, Toothfish, is to hire a guide if there's one in your area...my friends and I bounced around the tailraces for a few years and thought we were doing pretty o.k....about 3 years ago I booked a local guide (that specialises in tailrace fishing) and found out that we didn't know squat!
Since then, I've fished with the same guide at least a dozen times and learned somefin new every trip...a good guide is worth his weight in gold!
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  #7  
Old 02-15-2007, 09:57 PM
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Slowretrieve Slowretrieve is offline
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

In Indiana the most prevalent baitfish for wipers is the gizzard shad. Perhaps unfortunatley, although the lake has tons of them in it, you can't use them as live bait for wiper fishing. There is only one lake in the state where you can do that, and there are only stripers there, not wipers. Why? Who knows.

Catch a 6+ pounder and cut open its stomach and you will usually find a few 6 inch shad nestled deep inside.
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Old 02-15-2007, 10:00 PM
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

As far as I know, you cannot catch a wiper at night, though people often tell me that's a bunch of crap. My experience suggests they are active mornings until about 11 a.m. and then they hide until about an hour before sunset. They are most fishable from about 7 p.m. until absolute dark, which is usually about 10 p.m.

I like casting form them. Engines spook them easily and use up a lot of fuel unnecessarily.
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Old 02-16-2007, 09:56 AM
Toothfish Toothfish is offline
 
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

"The best advice I can give you, Toothfish, is to hire a guide if there's one in your area"

This made me laugh...Not at the one posting it ...It's just that I'm probably one of hand full that actually fish for wipers here in Iowa.
Not to toot my horn .... although I'm not a guide....... I guess I would be considered a Wiper .....person/guide.

Our lake/res. is absolutely packed full of gizzard shad. IT'S ILLEGAL TO HAVE LIVE GIZZARDSHAD IN ONES POSSESION . This is to protect other lakes that have proven to be intolerant to the effects of the gizzard shad.

Outboards may spook them..I use electric to troll for them. That brings up another part of my on going hypotheses. When shad are being attacked and they "ball" up....Is there any noise that in produced by their fins and bodies striking/touching each other ?
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Old 02-16-2007, 11:20 PM
LittleMiamiJeff LittleMiamiJeff is offline
 
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toothfish View Post
Outboards may spook them..I use electric to troll for them. That brings up another part of my on going hypotheses. When shad are being attacked and they "ball" up....Is there any noise that in produced by their fins and bodies striking/touching each other ?
Man, you are drilling down!
could be, would have to be some kind of noise/vibration, which may be why rattles and spinning blades are productive w/artificial lures.

Not a biologist, but just the swimming/energy put off by these bait fish, and predators has to be transmitted through the water, and received/perceived by the fish?
Coupled with the visual flashing and writhing of the bait ball, must make 'em drool!

LMJ
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Old 02-17-2007, 12:35 AM
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Striperjim Striperjim is offline
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Toothfish
Heres an interesting post on golden shiners. A 20 pound Nebraska record was taken on a golden shiner.
https://stripers247.com/phpBB2/showpo...45&postcount=1
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  #12  
Old 02-17-2007, 10:00 AM
Toothfish Toothfish is offline
 
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

There is some more great info !!! Thanks ! I see that they believe they are sterile fish.....???

It's in my nature to study and investigate the animal I'm after. All aspects have to be examined.
The reason I bring up sound is some reservoirs have very poor clarity ...but still the wipers find the schools of bait.
The case with the golden shinners reinforces some of the things we know to be true about these unique fish. They hunt the expanses of a lake as nomads ,following and searching for their next meal. Patterns relate to forage fish and where they can trap or surround their quarry.
My goal is to be able to locate these fish with some regularity this coming season. This will be the key in the reservoir that I fish.

The lure system that I have been using gives off intense vibration and utilizes a rattle.
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  #13  
Old 02-17-2007, 10:09 AM
Toothfish Toothfish is offline
 
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

Smack tackle Gizz4 utilizes a rattle as do most bass/crank baits. I'm currently working with a local spinner-bait manufacturer to produce an in-line spinner (mepps like) with a rattle system. FISH ON !!!!

One more thing about forage fish. The wipers I have caught all smell like gizzard shad. That is pretty much all they consume and so it stands to reason that is what they smell like. Even after washing my hands..I can still smell gizzard shad ! YUCK !!!
My question is..(you knew there was going to be a question ! ) Is this true in your area ...do they smell like your local forage fish ???
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:54 AM
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Slowretrieve Slowretrieve is offline
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

I never noticed that any of our Indiana wipers cared one way or the other about noise in a bait. In fact, they never seem to care a great deal about vibration, but they are very sensative to color. They are also sensative to motor noise; get too close with the big engine and they scatter. In our lakes, I think you are right; they tend to trap baitfish against the shore, any abrupt depth change like a wall, and against shallowing water. I agree, too, that they tend to surround their prey and push them toward ideal slaughter grounds.

Our Indiana fish also smell somewhat like shad, though thier odor is not as strong. I love catching that first fish of the Spring, hoisting it aboard, tossing it into the ice well--I lined my livewell with construction grade insulating foam so it keeps iced all day--then for the rest of the afternoon, every time my hand gets anywhere near my nose, I get a small whiff of the fish. What a great smell! If it gets too intense, stop by your local Autozone and pick up a bunch of packets of GoJo handcleaning cloths. They smell like oranges, and when you're done fishing for the day, they're great for cleaning off your rods and reels. Five or six packets-I think there are about two rags to a pack-fit easily into the tacklebox and keep all summer.
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Old 02-17-2007, 12:00 PM
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Default Re: Lets talk about forage fish

I believe most experts believe the wiper is sterile, as are most hybrid anythings. Rarely, they may be able to reporduce on their own, but the numbers would be so miniscule they would not amount to much.

That sterile quality is what the fisheries guys love about the wiper. When a lake is overrun with shad, they can turn loose the wiper, they clean up the lake, and about eight years later the wiper population is history. In the meantime, they provided some excellent fishing for you and I. What could be better?

Of course, that does not take into account how the gizzard shad populations thoughout America are currently exploding. Seems the more wipers and stripers they add to the lakes, the more the gizzard shad reproduce.
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